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Josh Harrison--Uh, oh... GO NEAL? Rate Topic: -----

#61 User is offline   mvk112 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:50 AM

Harrison is up to .280/.317/.397/.714, 98 OPS+

Since May 12th, he's .377/.412/.500/.912 with 7 SB in 131 PA.

I think it was early May last year when he started hitting the crap out of the ball.
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#62 User is offline   NYPirate 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:59 AM

This thread should be renamed "Neil Walker, uh oh.."
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#63 User is offline   aso513 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 10:01 AM

View Postmvk112, on 16 June 2015 - 09:50 AM, said:

Harrison is up to .280/.317/.397/.714, 98 OPS+

Since May 12th, he's .377/.412/.500/.912 with 7 SB in 131 PA.

I think it was early May last year when he started hitting the crap out of the ball.


2014:

Up until May 2nd- .208/.240/.375
May 2nd on- .321/.352/.496
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#64 User is offline   mvk112 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 10:21 AM

View PostNYPirate, on 16 June 2015 - 09:59 AM, said:

This thread should be renamed "Neil Walker, uh oh.."


Since that same May 12th date that I posted for Harrison -


Walker - .226/.264/.339/.604 in 121 PA (.286 BABIP)
Kang - .250/.349/.337/.686 in 106 PA (.319 BABIP)
Mercer - .280/.316/.413/.730 in 81 PA (.322 BABIP)
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#65 User is offline   mzimmerman81 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 10:25 AM

View PostNYPirate, on 16 June 2015 - 09:59 AM, said:

This thread should be renamed "Neil Walker, uh oh.."

If he was signed to a long term contract it probably would be
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#66 User is offline   aso513 

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 10:29 AM

View Postmzimmerman81, on 16 June 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

If he was signed to a long term contract it probably would be


Yes indeed.
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Posted 16 June 2015 - 10:31 AM

Since the start of 2014, Harrison has an OPS of .799 in almost 800 plate appearances. It's probably past the point where people should continue to expect him to collapse. He'll never walk as much as you'd like, but if he has 60 XBH and hits close to .300, that's really useful.
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Posted 16 June 2015 - 12:56 PM

View PostUtterly Irredeemable, on 16 June 2015 - 10:31 AM, said:

It's probably past the point where people should continue to expect him to collapse.


Talking about yourself in the 3rd person ?
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#69 User is offline   Yak 

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Posted 17 June 2015 - 03:51 PM

View Postblurjose, on 08 June 2015 - 12:11 PM, said:

Can you update us on Pedro's ADHD please?


When they show closeups of Andrew McCutchen's face at the plate, you know what's going on in his head. You can see it.

Same with Cervelli. Same with Harrison.

And pitchers all the time when they're on the mound.

Then look into Pedro's eyes when he's about to ground out to shallow right. Again. And tell me you have any earthly idea what's going on in his head.

It's like the lights are on but nobody's home.

Not always, but often enough to notice. Military guys called the "thousand yard stare."
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#70 User is offline   Jeff King 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:11 AM

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I've seen some discussion this morning of the possibility of Josh Harrison taking over 2B from Neil Walker next year. I thought now would be a good time to update this thread since it's been three months. Here are Josh Harrison's 2015 numbers:

382 ABs

.280 Avg

.321 OBP

.374 SLG (24 Doubles, 0 Triples)

.695 OPS/91OPS+

10 SBs/8 Caught Stealing (10-18 in steal attempts? Talk about hurting your team's chances to score runs. Although it's likely Hurdle's fault, not JHay's.)

He missed a month of the season due to injury, but I think it's been long enough after his return that we can say he's no longer shaking off the rust. I think we've also seen enough of Josh Harrison that we can safely say that we should not expect to see him put up his 2014 numbers again.

In a nutshell, here's what we have in Josh Harrison:

-A player with positional versatility (although the more I see him play, the more it becomes obvious that he's not a very good defender)

-A player who is not selective at the plate and will swing at pretty much anything. Despite that, he's still a decent hitter.

-A player who lacks power.

-A player who has some value and is worthy of a roster spot, but will earn too much money based on the contract he got from NEAL.
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#71 User is offline   bucc-o-pain 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:21 AM

View PostJeff King, on 23 September 2015 - 10:11 AM, said:


-A player who has some value and is worthy of a roster spot, but will earn too much money based on the contract he got from NEAL.

Ding ding ding! We have a winner. This was my concern when most here were loving the deal when it went down. Next year's 5 million might still be acceptable but the following year at 7.5 million looks like a clear over-pay. The 10 million in 2018 will be a roster killer. Again, we can't look at bench player's values league wide. We have to view this in terms of how the current ownership will react to the expense. If you don't think another area of the team will suffer while the Pirates overpay a bench player, well then you're just not paying attention.
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#72 User is offline   ecbenito 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:25 AM

View PostJeff King, on 23 September 2015 - 10:11 AM, said:

I've seen some discussion this morning of the possibility of Josh Harrison taking over 2B from Neil Walker next year. I thought now would be a good time to update this thread since it's been three months. Here are Josh Harrison's 2015 numbers:

382 ABs

.280 Avg

.321 OBP

.374 SLG (24 Doubles, 0 Triples)

.695 OPS/91OPS+

10 SBs/8 Caught Stealing (10-18 in steal attempts? Talk about hurting your team's chances to score runs. Although it's likely Hurdle's fault, not JHay's.)

He missed a month of the season due to injury, but I think it's been long enough after his return that we can say he's no longer shaking off the rust. I think we've also seen enough of Josh Harrison that we can safely say that we should not expect to see him put up his 2014 numbers again.

In a nutshell, here's what we have in Josh Harrison:

-A player with positional versatility (although the more I see him play, the more it becomes obvious that he's not a very good defender)

-A player who is not selective at the plate and will swing at pretty much anything. Despite that, he's still a decent hitter.

-A player who lacks power.

-A player who has some value and is worthy of a roster spot, but will earn too much money based on the contract he got from NEAL.


yeah, there was a column on ESPN a few days ago about letting Walker walk (or trading him) and turning 2B over to Harrison and 3B to Kang. I love what Kang did this season, but with the injury he had I'd really pump the brakes on penciling him in a any long term solution until we see how he recovers. Walker didn't have the best season this year and likely drove his price down a bit but even if he had another .800 OPS season, I still think you almost have to bring him back. Harrison is what he is, a super utility player that while useful shouldn't be in the everyday lineup of a World Series contender. SS is still a gigantic question mark (Mercer and Flormino both fucking blow) as is 3B with Pedro at 1B/moving on and Kang being injured. They overpaid Harrison a bit based off of a career year last year and as has been stated he's still an extremely useful player.
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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:30 AM

View Postecbenito, on 23 September 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

yeah, there was a column on ESPN a few days ago about letting Walker walk (or trading him) and turning 2B over to Harrison and 3B to Kang. I love what Kang did this season, but with the injury he had I'd really pump the brakes on penciling him in a any long term solution until we see how he recovers. Walker didn't have the best season this year and likely drove his price down a bit but even if he had another .800 OPS season, I still think you almost have to bring him back. Harrison is what he is, a super utility player that while useful shouldn't be in the everyday lineup of a World Series contender. SS is still a gigantic question mark (Mercer and Flormino both fucking blow) as is 3B with Pedro at 1B/moving on and Kang being injured. They overpaid Harrison a bit based off of a career year last year and as has been stated he's still an extremely useful player.

I like your idea in theory but would Walker sign say a one or two year contract? Because I wouldn't give him anything more than that and I think he and his agent will be looking for more. My worry is that he is on the decline and that it's risky to get stuck with him even though he's our best immediate solution.
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#74 User is offline   GoBucs21 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:33 AM

View PostYak, on 17 June 2015 - 03:51 PM, said:

When they show closeups of Andrew McCutchen's face at the plate, you know what's going on in his head. You can see it.

Same with Cervelli. Same with Harrison.

And pitchers all the time when they're on the mound.

Then look into Pedro's eyes when he's about to ground out to shallow right. Again. And tell me you have any earthly idea what's going on in his head.

It's like the lights are on but nobody's home.

Not always, but often enough to notice. Military guys called the "thousand yard stare."

The comment about "the lights are on but nobody's home", relates to a person's intellect. It is nothing like the "thousand yard stare". That is related to battle fatigue or PTSD or another battle related trauma. I'm pretty sure that none of those apply to Pedro.

Honestly, I don't see how anyone can watch a player from afar or worse on TV and make some sort of psychological evaluation of a player. When people do this type of assessment, I believe more often than not, they are projecting what they want to believe to confirm a preconceived notion.
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#75 User is offline   GoBucs21 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:36 AM

View Postblurjose, on 23 September 2015 - 10:30 AM, said:

I like your idea in theory but would Walker sign say a one or two year contract? Because I wouldn't give him anything more than that and I think he and his agent will be looking for more. My worry is that he is on the decline and that it's risky to get stuck with him even though he's our best immediate solution.

Walker will sign a one year deal if he's not traded, whether it's through arbitration or negotiated because he has no options. I don't see him signing a two year deal though. He would be 31 years old. I think he will take the right one year deal and then look for a 4 to 5 year deal at the end of next season.

I think the Pirates will trade Walker.
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#76 User is offline   ecbenito 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:37 AM

View PostGoBucs21, on 23 September 2015 - 10:33 AM, said:

The comment about "the lights are on but nobody's home", relates to a person's intellect. It is nothing like the "thousand yard stare". That is related to battle fatigue or PTSD or another battle related trauma. I'm pretty sure that none of those apply to Pedro.

Honestly, I don't see how anyone can watch a player from afar or worse on TV and make some sort of psychological evaluation of a player. When people do this type of assessment, I believe more often than not, they are projecting what they want to believe to confirm a preconceived notion.

so what you're telling me is that the defeated look in Oliver Perez's eyes didn't really mean anything?
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#77 User is offline   ecbenito 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:38 AM

View PostGoBucs21, on 23 September 2015 - 10:36 AM, said:

Walker will sign a one year deal if he's not traded, whether it's through arbitration or negotiated because he has no options. I don't see him signing a two year deal though. He would be 31 years old. I think he will take the right one year deal and then look for a 4 to 5 year deal at the end of next season.

I think the Pirates will trade Walker.

yeah, I think this is the most likely scenario that plays out and that's what scares me. There really isn't any other everyday option for 2B.
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#78 User is offline   GoBucs21 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:42 AM

View Postecbenito, on 23 September 2015 - 10:38 AM, said:

yeah, I think this is the most likely scenario that plays out and that's what scares me. There really isn't any other everyday option for 2B.

I don't think they have a good everyday option. I think NH believes Harrison is a good everyday option for Walker.
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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:50 AM

I don't think anyone is advocating for Harrison to be the 2B next year. I just think it's the reality we will end up facing.
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#80 User is offline   NYPirate 

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:54 AM

View PostUtterly Irredeemable, on 23 September 2015 - 10:50 AM, said:

I don't think anyone is advocating for Harrison to be the 2B next year. I just think it's the reality we will end up facing.

The Pirates crying poor next year would be such a crock of shit. They have so much money coming off the books after next season it's ridiculous. Absorbing everyone's salary for one season should be a no brainier,even without the money coming off the books soon. Yet Bob Nutting will be an asshole, so he'll likely dump Walker, Alvarez, and Melancon.
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