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Pirates off season thread Because we're still a Pirates board? Rate Topic: -----

#1981 User is offline   Jermaine Allensworth 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 12:18 PM

View Postdonwengert4life, on 14 March 2017 - 08:40 AM, said:

A lot of the guys on that list are good but not great pitchers. If Glasnow ends up like AJ Burnett or Ryan Dempster...I mean, there's no shame in that, but the aspirations for him have been much higher.


If Glasnow becomes Burnett/Dempster, than the Pirates should thank their lucky stars. Right now he's looking like he may not even make it in the bullpen.
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#1982 User is offline   bucc-o-pain 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 12:53 PM

View PostJermaine Allensworth, on 14 March 2017 - 12:18 PM, said:

If Glasnow becomes Burnett/Dempster, than the Pirates should thank their lucky stars. Right now he's looking like he may not even make it in the bullpen.

The "OMG Glasnow" craziness needs to cool out. Sure he may have to start the year in AAA but why is everyone freaking out about a couple spring training outings? Maybe they are having him work on certain things during those outings and aren't necessarily concerned with him getting outs. We know for a fact he is working on a new delivery, so give the kid some time.

Also, I am quite certain that if Glasnow was moved to the pen and only had to concern himself with throwing his gas and curve for an inning, he would dominate. We are talking about a man who is 6'8'' trying to get a the wrinkles ironed out, not some kid that can't hit the broadside of a barn. Remember, we are talking about a pitcher that has logged 500 minor league innings to the tune of a .172 BAA and a 1.09 WHIP. That said, he isn't going to get moved to pen without multiple years of failure at the big league level and rightfully so.
Utah, get me two.
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#1983 User is offline   PSU4Lyfe 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 12:54 PM

View Postbucc-o-pain, on 14 March 2017 - 12:53 PM, said:

The "OMG Glasnow" craziness needs to cool out. Sure he may have to start the year in AAA but why is everyone freaking out about a couple spring training outings? Maybe they are having him work on certain things during those outings and aren't necessarily concerned with him getting outs. We know for a fact he is working on a new delivery, so give the kid some time.

Also, I am quite certain that if Glasnow was moved to the pen and only had to concern himself with throwing his gas and curve for an inning, he would dominate. We are talking about a man who is 6'8'' trying to get a the wrinkles ironed out, not some kid that can't hit the broadside of a barn. Remember, we are talking about a pitcher that has logged 500 minor league innings to the tune of a .172 BAA and a 1.09 WHIP. That said, he isn't going to get moved to pen without multiple years of failure at the big league level and rightfully so.


This brings up an interesting point. Would we be upset if he ended up being Betances?
Disclaimer: This post in no way supports nor defends the signing of Rod Barajas.
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#1984 User is online   GoBucs21 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 01:47 PM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 14 March 2017 - 12:54 PM, said:

This brings up an interesting point. Would we be upset if he ended up being Betances?

Disappointed more than upset. If we were thinking he was Randy Johnson and get Betances, yes that is disappointing but it doesn't mean he has no value.
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Day of commemoration to honor the Victims of Bowling Green, April 1, 2017.
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#1985 User is offline   bucc-o-pain 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 01:49 PM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 14 March 2017 - 12:54 PM, said:

This brings up an interesting point. Would we be upset if he ended up being Betances?

Now? Yes. After a few years of watching him struggle as a starter? Prolly not upset at all.
Utah, get me two.
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#1986 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 02:20 PM

View Postdonwengert4life, on 14 March 2017 - 08:40 AM, said:

A lot of the guys on that list are good but not great pitchers. If Glasnow ends up like AJ Burnett or Ryan Dempster...I mean, there's no shame in that, but the aspirations for him have been much higher.


There are some pretty damn good pitchers on that list. Glasnow could flame out completely, end up as a top reliever, have a Burnett like career...or something else. Way to early to assume anything.

One thing is for sure, he does not have to have a change to be successful.
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#1987 User is offline   jestor92 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 02:36 PM

I'm worried because i read somewhere he rebuilt his delivery or something like that.
The kid was great in the minors with his delivery and decent when given a chance with the big team. He needs experience not a new delivery.
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#1988 User is online   GoBucs21 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 03:08 PM

View Postjestor92, on 14 March 2017 - 02:36 PM, said:

I'm worried because i read somewhere he rebuilt his delivery or something like that.
The kid was great in the minors with his delivery and decent when given a chance with the big team. He needs experience not a new delivery.

I remember when the Nationals completely rebuilt Josh Smoker's pitching motion. They took him all the back to little league teaching. Smoker just made it to the majors at 27, last year. He only pitched 15 innings but had 25 whiffs (14.7K/9) and just four walks. He also gave up four home runs and 16 hits total.
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Day of commemoration to honor the Victims of Bowling Green, April 1, 2017.
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#1989 User is online   Sloshy 

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 03:30 PM

View PostGoBucs21, on 14 March 2017 - 03:08 PM, said:

I remember when the Nationals completely rebuilt Josh Smoker's pitching motion. They took him all the back to little league teaching. Smoker just made it to the majors at 27, last year. He only pitched 15 innings but had 25 whiffs (14.7K/9) and just four walks. He also gave up four home runs and 16 hits total.

I am both turned on and repulsed. This is not altogether an unusual state of being for me...
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#1990 User is online   Vegetable 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 12:17 PM

El Toro in mid season form already. Three pitch K.
"Well be comfortable adding one (starter), he said. Well be comfortable adding nobody if its just not there. We dont feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, thats great. If we can add two that make sense then we do that.
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#1991 User is offline   BadAndy79 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 01:37 PM

Phil Gosselin trade seems to be working out so far.
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#1992 User is offline   NYPirate 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 02:00 PM

View Postbucc-o-pain, on 14 March 2017 - 12:53 PM, said:

The "OMG Glasnow" craziness needs to cool out. Sure he may have to start the year in AAA but why is everyone freaking out about a couple spring training outings? Maybe they are having him work on certain things during those outings and aren't necessarily concerned with him getting outs. We know for a fact he is working on a new delivery, so give the kid some time.

Also, I am quite certain that if Glasnow was moved to the pen and only had to concern himself with throwing his gas and curve for an inning, he would dominate. We are talking about a man who is 6'8'' trying to get a the wrinkles ironed out, not some kid that can't hit the broadside of a barn. Remember, we are talking about a pitcher that has logged 500 minor league innings to the tune of a .172 BAA and a 1.09 WHIP. That said, he isn't going to get moved to pen without multiple years of failure at the big league level and rightfully so.

He's a supposed major league ready, top prospect that has:

1) Mechanical Issues
2) Control Issues
3) A third pitch that's nowhere close to MLB ready

Sorry if you disagree, but I see several red flags.
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#1993 User is offline   bucc-o-pain 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 02:17 PM

View PostNYPirate, on 15 March 2017 - 02:00 PM, said:

He's a supposed major league ready, top prospect that has:

1) Mechanical Issues
2) Control Issues
3) A third pitch that's nowhere close to MLB ready

Sorry if you disagree, but I see several red flags.

I agree that there are some red flags and there's nothing wrong with pointing those out. I was more or less commenting on the sky is falling type comments concerning his spring outings. He has things to work on to be successful at the big league level but it isn't like the kid is a total mess.
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#1994 User is online   Vegetable 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 03:14 PM

Greg Maddox first full big league season 1987 - ERA+ 76
Tom Glavine first full big league season 1988 - ERA+ 80

Both turned out OK. Maybe at some point you have to find out what you have.
"Well be comfortable adding one (starter), he said. Well be comfortable adding nobody if its just not there. We dont feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, thats great. If we can add two that make sense then we do that.
Opie Taylor. In a decisive moment.
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#1995 User is offline   PSU4Lyfe 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 03:34 PM

View PostVegetable, on 15 March 2017 - 03:14 PM, said:

Greg Maddox first full big league season 1987 - ERA+ 76
Tom Glavine first full big league season 1988 - ERA+ 80

Both turned out OK. Maybe at some point you have to find out what you have.


Every pitcher that comes up and sucks will turn in to Greg Maddox? Or what is the point here? Nobody should ever worry because outliers exist?
Disclaimer: This post in no way supports nor defends the signing of Rod Barajas.
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#1996 User is offline   coolpapacole 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 04:15 PM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 15 March 2017 - 03:34 PM, said:

Every pitcher that comes up and sucks will turn in to Greg Maddox? Or what is the point here? Nobody should ever worry because outliers exist?

I took his point to be that just because someone struggles at the ML level at first, it doesn't mean they are at the wrong level. Maybe Glasnow needs to simply get to the majors and learn there.

Maybe I am wrong though.
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#1997 User is offline   ArkansasPirate 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 07:45 PM

I have read all of the talk about Glasnow and I think that he must have a third pitch to make it at the MLB level. His fastball is good but he can't live on it because he can't seem to keep it in the strike zone. Development of the third pitch or developing control of the two he has may take half a season in AAA
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#1998 User is offline   silverspring 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 09:10 PM

Aren't we forgetting the spring-is-opposite rule? Although, with the Pirates, it usually only applies to guys doing really well. :(
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#1999 User is offline   Martini 

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 10:32 PM

View Postbucc-o-pain, on 15 March 2017 - 02:17 PM, said:

I agree that there are some red flags and there's nothing wrong with pointing those out. I was more or less commenting on the sky is falling type comments concerning his spring outings. He has things to work on to be successful at the big league level but it isn't like the kid is a total mess.

I gotta agree here. There really have only been a handful of truly dominant pitchers as tall as Glasnow. Still, I do think you have to ride it out, and I don't think AAA is really the place to do it. Not saying I would bring up to start the season, but if he's hitting his spots, I wouldn't let him languish in the minors for too long either.
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#2000 User is online   Vegetable 

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Posted 16 March 2017 - 12:41 AM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 15 March 2017 - 03:34 PM, said:

Every pitcher that comes up and sucks will turn in to Greg Maddox? Or what is the point here? Nobody should ever worry because outliers exist?


Lighten up Francis. I didn't post that Glasnow was the next Maddux. Or the next Glavine. Hell, I didn't even reply to anybody else's post or mention Glasnow.

A couple of guys that are competing for the fifth starters job have outpitched Glasnow this spring. He needs to start the year in Indy. Watched several of Glasnows AAA starts online last year. He was throwing 98 - 100 mph fastballs and a 12 to 6 curveball. The stuff he showed in the big leagues last season and this spring doesn't even come close to the stuff he had in AAA. I think the dropoff is a mental issue and that he will get that stuff back. He may be trying too hard when he's fighting for a big league roster spot. Could be that he needs assurance that he's going to get an extended shot. When they're 30 games behind the Cubs at the end of June, put him in the big league rotation and tell him that it's his job indefinitely. In any case, it's too early to write him off.
"Well be comfortable adding one (starter), he said. Well be comfortable adding nobody if its just not there. We dont feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, thats great. If we can add two that make sense then we do that.
Opie Taylor. In a decisive moment.
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