Pittsburgh Pirates: Steeler's Offseason Thread - Pittsburgh Pirates

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Steeler's Offseason Thread Rate Topic: -----

#981 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:44 AM

View Postjcharding, on 18 May 2017 - 10:02 PM, said:

Relax. This was a relatively minor signing. Its not remotely big enough to be colossal.



Looks like they still have $16 mil in cap space. Some would go to the rookies, but I would think they could at least sign Tuitt and Villanueva. Tuitt, Villanueva, Bell, Boswell and Cockrell seem to be the only significant players that would be FAs after the 2017 season. The 2018 projected cap space is around $36 mil, so even if they sign all of those guys except Bell, they should still have a ton of space for 2018.
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#982 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 03:06 PM

The free agent TE from Fordham looks like it has possibilities: That man has some serious size and leaping ability. Fazehan Odom or something?
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#983 User is online   v2burghboy 

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 03:18 PM

Tim Tebow ...

“I hear this guy behind me yell, ‘Watch out,’” said Brustman. “And as he’s yelling, the ball comes right through the railing and hits me right in the nuts. It was a direct hit.”

[...]

“It was literally like a Seinfeld episode. The guy behind me shouts, ‘It was TEBOW,’” said Brustman. “It reminded me of his days with the Jets when he couldn’t complete a pass. This guy is so inaccurate, even with a baseball.”
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#984 User is offline   Winterset Resurrection 

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 07:04 PM

View PostVegetable, on 18 May 2017 - 10:54 PM, said:

Jesse James is an adequate pass catcher and was improving as a blocker. He's not the deep threat that Green was, but do they need that with Martavis Bryant back? If they go empty back field, it's going to going to be fun to watch teams try to deal with AB and Martavis on the outside at the same time they're trying to cover James, Eli Rogers, and JuJu down the middle.
And maybe they find a role for JuJu as an additional blocker in the running game. He looks like he can hit people.


There are very few NFL TE that are deep threats.

I think James is a fine pass catcher. I've personally never seen a huge deficiency in his blocking, but that's the apparent knock against him.
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#985 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 03:15 AM

Green was a deep threat? The guy played like 4 games and then was gone. Bust. I suppose he was a deep threat in San Diego, maybe 22 concussions ago, I guess...
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#986 User is online   Gideon Clarke 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 04:28 AM

View PostGrey, on 20 May 2017 - 03:15 AM, said:

Green was a deep threat?

He had a 20 yard TD plus catches of 23, 28, 32, 33, 35, and 37 yards. All of that in six games. So yeah, I'd say he was a deep threat.
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#987 User is offline   donwengert4life 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 08:43 AM

Green made a big difference when he was healthy. He was just never healthy.

Lesson: Don't waste money on guys with a history of concussions.

Jesse James is probably adequate if the receiving corps stays healthy and off the suspended list but when he was able to play Green was a significant upgrade.
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#988 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 08:52 AM

[quote name='Gideon Clarke' timestamp='1495272535' post='855481']
He had a 20 yard TD plus catches of 23, 28, 32, 33, 35, and 37 yards. All of that in six games. So yeah, I'd say he was a deep threat.
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I'd say he was a bust and one of the worst signings in the history of the franchise. 6 catches of over 20 yards is fantastic, but not for an entire season. He wasn't healthy.
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#989 User is online   Gideon Clarke 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 09:33 AM

View PostGrey, on 20 May 2017 - 08:52 AM, said:

I'd say he was a bust and one of the worst signings in the history of the franchise. 6 catches of over 20 yards is fantastic, but not for an entire season. He wasn't healthy.

I didn't say he was healthy. I said he was a deep threat.
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#990 User is online   Gideon Clarke 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 09:40 AM

Oh, and Jesse James had two catches of 20 yards or more, so if seven are unacceptable, we're pretty screwed now.
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#991 User is offline   Vegetable 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 11:58 AM

Green was a weapon when healthy and James is an adequate TE. But maybe the position becomes even more irrelevant this season. Might see a lot of four wide receivers plus Leveon. Or more of the six offensive lineman sets with Hubbard at TE when they want to run the ball.
"We’ll be comfortable adding one (starter),” he said. “We’ll be comfortable adding nobody if it’s just not there. We don’t feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, that’s great. If we can add two that make sense … then we do that.”
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#992 User is offline   Winterset Resurrection 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 12:35 PM

Maybe, but I also think it's poor timing on the Steelers' part to basically ignore the TE position at a time when more and more NFL teams are seriously incorporating them back into their offenses.
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#993 User is online   v2burghboy 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 02:55 PM

View PostWinterset Resurrection, on 20 May 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

Maybe, but I also think it's poor timing on the Steelers' part to basically ignore the TE position at a time when more and more NFL teams are seriously incorporating them back into their offenses.


Have they ignored tight end?

They had Heath Miller forever. They signed Ladarius Green to a $20 million deal. They may have taken David Njoku 30th overall but didn't have a chance. If they really wanted him, they had the picks to move up a few spots. They didn't.

They also didn't take anyone after the first round at the position, and probably with good reason. If they didn't feel anyone at that position could help them more than Jesse James, you don't bother. It doesn't mean they ignored it -- it means they didn't have another available guy who they felt could help them more.

That's not to say I agree with everything they do. I don't. I'm not sold on JSS in the second round. I'd much rather have 3-4 receivers that can stretch the field in this league. I thought James Conner was taken a round too early. I wouldn't have picked a long snapper at all -- just sign 3 guys after the draft and have them battle it out.

But did they ignore tight end? I don't think so. I think every team has a hole somewhere. This one has a few, and tight end is one of them. But you don't just pick a player from x position to take a player at that position. If that's the only criteria, you're doing it wrong.
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#994 User is online   Gideon Clarke 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 05:43 PM

View PostVegetable, on 20 May 2017 - 11:58 AM, said:

Green was a weapon when healthy and James is an adequate TE. But maybe the position becomes even more irrelevant this season. Might see a lot of four wide receivers plus Leveon. Or more of the six offensive lineman sets with Hubbard at TE when they want to run the ball.

If they use six OL, it would be dumb not to make Villanueva the eligible receiver.

View PostWinterset Resurrection, on 20 May 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

Maybe, but I also think it's poor timing on the Steelers' part to basically ignore the TE position at a time when more and more NFL teams are seriously incorporating them back into their offenses.

You don't get anywhere by following trends in the NFL.
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#995 User is offline   Vegetable 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 06:09 PM

View PostGideon Clarke, on 20 May 2017 - 05:43 PM, said:

If they use six OL, it would be dumb not to make Villanueva the eligible receiver.




Probably a good idea. But they used the 6 O lineman formation a good bit last season, and Hubbard lined up at TE.
"We’ll be comfortable adding one (starter),” he said. “We’ll be comfortable adding nobody if it’s just not there. We don’t feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, that’s great. If we can add two that make sense … then we do that.”
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#996 User is online   Gideon Clarke 

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 09:46 PM

View PostVegetable, on 20 May 2017 - 06:09 PM, said:

Probably a good idea. But they used the 6 O lineman formation a good bit last season, and Hubbard lined up at TE.

Well, that was dumb.
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#997 User is offline   Winterset Resurrection 

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 06:19 AM

You don't get anywhere by following trends in the NFL? That's a pretty random assertion.

Let's not be so quick to forgive the Steelers on this one. They had a good draft, but they fucked up with regards to TE. Pure and simple. They fell asleep at the switch, and allowed division rival Cleveland to fuck them over for the final good one.

Saying we shouldn't "follow trends" is goofy. That's like saying, "Wr know Ben Roethlisberger is a great QB, but we're intentionally going to give him less options, because that's the opposite of what other teams are doing.
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#998 User is offline   jestor92 

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 12:03 PM

They fucked up in a few areas in the draft. No solid inside linebacker taken, no tight end taken, drafting a fucking long snapper.

If juju performs well that's huge for the offense because add him to AB, the weed king, and Eli that's a solid core of receivers. However they're not going to be running four WRs out there each play and are going to need a tight end who can block and catch. James is decent enough but he leaves a bit to be desired because of his inability to stretch the field which is needed in two receiver sets.

I agree with a poster from before they could've brought 2-3 long snappers in signed the best one.
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#999 User is offline   jcharding 

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 12:11 PM

Think of it this way, is the team's third ILB - in a league where probably two-third's of the time teams will be playing with a maximum of one ILB because they are in a nickle or dime - more important than a long snapper?

We are so mentally wedded to the idea of the base 3-4 defense that we just aren't seeing reality - which is that the primary purpose of the third ILB (2nd?) is to play special teams and maybe serve as an intermittent replacement due to injury. Are not most special teamers even more fungible than long snappers? Aren't these the guys that last roughly 1.5 seasons?

And given the increasingly dwindling role of ILBs in the NFL? Aren't they becoming the defensive version of a fullback? How often do teams draft fullbacks anymore? Much less their third fullback?
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#1000 User is offline   Vegetable 

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 12:38 PM

View Postjestor92, on 21 May 2017 - 12:03 PM, said:

They fucked up in a few areas in the draft. No solid inside linebacker taken, no tight end taken, drafting a fucking long snapper.

If juju performs well that's huge for the offense because add him to AB, the weed king, and Eli that's a solid core of receivers. However they're not going to be running four WRs out there each play and are going to need a tight end who can block and catch. James is decent enough but he leaves a bit to be desired because of his inability to stretch the field which is needed in two receiver sets.

I agree with a poster from before they could've brought 2-3 long snappers in signed the best one.


How often do they run two receiver sets? Don't see them using a fullback with Leveon very often - maybe short yardage or goal line. With only one RB and one TE, they're using three receivers. If AB is double teamed, Martavis is taking at least one other DB with him on a deep route, Eli Rogers is drawing some attention, LeVeon is maybe running a route out of the backfield; they shouldn't have to rely on Jesse James to stretch the field. Heath Miller caught a lot of balls but I don't think he "stretched the field".
"We’ll be comfortable adding one (starter),” he said. “We’ll be comfortable adding nobody if it’s just not there. We don’t feel we are driven to force it. If we can add one that makes sense for us, that’s great. If we can add two that make sense … then we do that.”
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