Pittsburgh Pirates: Starling Marte - Pittsburgh Pirates

Jump to content

  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

Starling Marte Idiot Rate Topic: -----

#41 User is offline   Winterset Resurrection 

  • TEAM CAT
  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 3,203
  • Joined: 15-November 16
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:31 AM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 21 April 2017 - 08:30 AM, said:

Just let everyone do whatever they want. Sports are entertainment. Stop taking them so seriously.


I'm saving this one. It will come in handy down the road...
0

#42 User is offline   PSU4Lyfe 

  • Veteran Manager
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 42,898
  • Joined: 16-November 08
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:54 AM

View PostWinterset Resurrection, on 21 April 2017 - 10:31 AM, said:

I'm saving this one. It will come in handy down the road...


How so? I'm pretty sure I've been consistent in my view of sports as entertainment and not some super serious thing.
Disclaimer: This post in no way supports nor defends the signing of Rod Barajas.
0

#43 User is offline   oblongatta 

  • Supreme Overlord of the Universe
  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 15,719
  • Joined: 17-November 08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:a bar
  • Interests:Whisper Fighting

Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:04 AM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 21 April 2017 - 08:30 AM, said:

Where do you draw the line on what gives an advantage that causes imbalance? Contact lenses and eye surgery can give someone better than perfect vision. There are plenty of supplements that were deemed good to use, why draw the line at all and just outlaw weigh lifting which can give an advantage?

Just let everyone do whatever they want. Sports are entertainment. Stop taking them so seriously.


I think these are good points. The idea of a level playing field is an hard one to determine. What if someone lifts weights every day? They got stronger and created an not level playing field for someone who chose not to lift weights. Obviously this is intentionally absurd.

At some point I was on the side of let them do whatever. But really, that can't be good. Some of these drugs are (can be?) very harmful. I don't want to be in a situation where you see ten other players taking a risky PED and then feel you need to do it. My current view is that it should be well specified in the rules of the sport. It should be under at least team medical supervision or perhaps an outside entity. It has to be at "safe" levels and it has to include guidance for a wide range of supplements. I think MLB has moved closer to at least having well specified guidelines even if a little on the strict side. As such, any level of discipline that is written out is unarguable.

Of course there is the question of what to do about the past. I'm on the side that with vague guidelines and apprently a look teh other way mentality, that era should be accepted as it was and no longer chastised.
You're pretty on the inside,
That's better than not pretty at all,
You're pretty on the inside,
Too bad I'm an outside kinda pretty guy.
0

#44 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

  • Bulldog Veteran
  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2,072
  • Joined: 19-April 16

Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:41 AM

View PostSloshy, on 21 April 2017 - 06:07 AM, said:

The entire concept of sports is predicated on the notion of an even playing field. Why do you care about the payroll of the Pirates vs. other teams? Because it creates imbalance.

PEDs creates imbalance, and don't give me the typical response that "everyone is doing then." We don't know that, and I don't think it's true anyways.

That some might be and some aren't creates imbalance, and it destroys (for me) what makes sports interesting in the first place -- competition between two sets of players with talent as the only differentiator. I do have some moral issues with PEDs vs. recreational drugs, and it is primarily based on how it damages that balance.

That's my opinion, and I get that some of you don't give a shit about balance... except when it comes to payroll...


Has there been a point where pro sports were balanced? Only level that is probably well balanced is little league.
0

#45 User is offline   PSU4Lyfe 

  • Veteran Manager
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 42,898
  • Joined: 16-November 08
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:46 AM

View Postoblongatta, on 21 April 2017 - 11:04 AM, said:

I think these are good points. The idea of a level playing field is an hard one to determine. What if someone lifts weights every day? They got stronger and created an not level playing field for someone who chose not to lift weights. Obviously this is intentionally absurd.

At some point I was on the side of let them do whatever. But really, that can't be good. Some of these drugs are (can be?) very harmful. I don't want to be in a situation where you see ten other players taking a risky PED and then feel you need to do it. My current view is that it should be well specified in the rules of the sport. It should be under at least team medical supervision or perhaps an outside entity. It has to be at "safe" levels and it has to include guidance for a wide range of supplements. I think MLB has moved closer to at least having well specified guidelines even if a little on the strict side. As such, any level of discipline that is written out is unarguable.

Of course there is the question of what to do about the past. I'm on the side that with vague guidelines and apprently a look teh other way mentality, that era should be accepted as it was and no longer chastised.


A more realistic comparison is the weird line we draw on "steroids." It is ok to take an injection in your knee or shoulder so that you can play on Sunday, so long as you are ok with understanding that it also wrecks your kidneys. But if you want to take steroids that make you stronger or leaner, those are not ok. Would the former not be an "edge" for the person who is ok with dying at age 50?
Disclaimer: This post in no way supports nor defends the signing of Rod Barajas.
0

#46 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

  • Bulldog Veteran
  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2,072
  • Joined: 19-April 16

Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:44 PM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 21 April 2017 - 11:46 AM, said:

A more realistic comparison is the weird line we draw on "steroids." It is ok to take an injection in your knee or shoulder so that you can play on Sunday, so long as you are ok with understanding that it also wrecks your kidneys. But if you want to take steroids that make you stronger or leaner, those are not ok. Would the former not be an "edge" for the person who is ok with dying at age 50?


I do not understand why cortisone is ok, or whatever pain killer/antiinflamatory they stick people with...but steroids are bad? Steroids can legitimately be used to recover from an injury. Seems like it would be smarter to control that with the team doc...I know they could be lying but multiple players have said they are using them for that purpose.
0

#47 User is offline   Sloshy 

  • Steve Pearce
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 395
  • Joined: 26-November 16
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 03:48 PM

View Postgahran, on 21 April 2017 - 06:44 AM, said:

All of the interest in sports comes from not having a level playing field.

You can set up a video game to simulate AI team vs. the exact same AI team and watch it but I can't even imagine why anybody would want to. There's nothing 'level' about winning a game because your team had Babe Ruth on it and the other team didn't.

Sure, and then balance of talent. Reread what I wrote buddy. If the only differentiator is talent, then the more talented team wins. Of course there's in balance and talent.
0

#48 User is offline   Sloshy 

  • Steve Pearce
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 395
  • Joined: 26-November 16
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 03:56 PM

View PostPSU4Lyfe, on 21 April 2017 - 08:30 AM, said:

Where do you draw the line on what gives an advantage that causes imbalance?

Well, I draw the line at things that are illegal of course. One could argue that Tommy John surgery takes someone who couldn't perform and gives them the ability to. I think there's a big difference between corrective surgery and injecting a drug that artificially enhances one's ability. I don't disagree that there is a fine line when it comes to supplements, but the union protect these players so they can cycle up and down and avoid detection. I hate it. I think it's cancer for the game.

And I understand that you don't share that opinion, that plenty of younger people don't share this opinion. I think of it as sad. My mind won't be changed, and neither will yours. It just is.

I think the reason baseball statistics are so revered is because it is one of the only team sports Where a player can be truly measured on their own talent. In every other other team sport, a player's success is dependent upon the rest of the team. A truly great running back cannot succeed without a solid offense of line. But offensively, it is a batter versus a pitcher. And vice versa. I know a piture benefits from asolid defense, but it is still Primarily man versus man.

It is our instinct as humans to appreciate the challenge presented by that scenario. It's instinctual. He cheating in baseball, for me, is felt on an almost primal level. And I understand that it doesn't do that for you, that you feel differently. I'm just describing how I feel. It's why I personally love this game.

So, you know, fuck you and your it's just entertain bullshit.
0

#49 User is offline   PSU4Lyfe 

  • Veteran Manager
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 42,898
  • Joined: 16-November 08
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 April 2017 - 04:26 PM

View PostSloshy, on 21 April 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

Well, I draw the line at things that are illegal of course. One could argue that Tommy John surgery takes someone who couldn't perform and gives them the ability to. I think there's a big difference between corrective surgery and injecting a drug that artificially enhances one's ability. I don't disagree that there is a fine line when it comes to supplements, but the union protect these players so they can cycle up and down and avoid detection. I hate it. I think it's cancer for the game.

And I understand that you don't share that opinion, that plenty of younger people don't share this opinion. I think of it as sad. My mind won't be changed, and neither will yours. It just is.

I think the reason baseball statistics are so revered is because it is one of the only team sports Where a player can be truly measured on their own talent. In every other other team sport, a player's success is dependent upon the rest of the team. A truly great running back cannot succeed without a solid offense of line. But offensively, it is a batter versus a pitcher. And vice versa. I know a piture benefits from asolid defense, but it is still Primarily man versus man.

It is our instinct as humans to appreciate the challenge presented by that scenario. It's instinctual. He cheating in baseball, for me, is felt on an almost primal level. And I understand that it doesn't do that for you, that you feel differently. I'm just describing how I feel. It's why I personally love this game.

So, you know, fuck you and your it's just entertain bullshit.


People can legally go get HGH, but baseball prohibits it. Do you think baseball players should be allowed to use HGH?

Spare me the nostalgic history stuff too. Every era has had its scandals whether it was the amphetamines of the 70's and 80's or the steroids of the 90's and 2000's.
Disclaimer: This post in no way supports nor defends the signing of Rod Barajas.
0

Share this topic:


  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic