Pittsburgh Pirates: Former Penn State coach Jerry Sandusky indicted on felony charges of sex crimes against minors - Pittsburgh Pirates

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Former Penn State coach Jerry Sandusky indicted on felony charges of sex crimes against minors Rate Topic: -----

#5281 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 03:40 PM

 GoBucs21, on 11 May 2017 - 02:54 PM, said:

It's not over. Paterno's kid become a "trustee" just starts the story over again. People will believe what they want based on any criteria they want. Opinions are difficult to change. We had a guy, a teacher, here in the DC area, who was charged with raping to young, teenage girls. Eventually, the girls admitted they lied because of grades. Some people never believed the teacher, even after the girls admitted they lied.

Like it or not, say the words Penn State or Penn State Football and the conversation will almost always get back to the Sandusky scandal. The school, like the Catholic Church (PSU was on a much smaller scale), failed to live up to its moral, legal, and ethical standards. Neither institution is shaking the perception of the masses any time soon.


On the topic of the teacher, I see your point. I watched the 30 for 30 on the Duke lacrosse players and it made my blood boil that they didn't throw that piece of shit accuser in prison for her lies, then excused her evil away by claiming she had "mental problems". Bullshit, she was an evil piece of shit, who by the way, is NOW serving a 12 year sentence for second degree MURDER any fucking way.

You are certainly right about the perception of the masses, but honestly, I lived in Tucson Arizona for 20 years, and have a lot of good friends there who root for the U of A, and frankly they don't care about PSU, they hate Arizona State though, lmao.
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#5282 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 03:45 PM

 NCBuccofan, on 11 May 2017 - 01:26 PM, said:

Not what I said.

What do you call this?

http://deadspin.com/...rmal-1794968512

It is not a joke about what happened. Penn St itself is the joke because of what they are doing.

it is not over. Penn State will not allow it to be over.


Deadspin? Deadspin is a fly circling the elephants, Espn and Fox sports. Now, I can't stand them EITHER, but just sayin. But hey, now I know Tom Ley doesn't like Penn State, which is alright because Penn State is hated by lots of people. Again, I agree that Jay needs to go far away from this place, and I wish he fucking would. He was critical of the Franklin staff last year and it pissed me off to no end.
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#5283 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 04:06 PM

 Grey, on 11 May 2017 - 03:45 PM, said:

Deadspin? Deadspin is a fly circling the elephants, Espn and Fox sports. Now, I can't stand them EITHER, but just sayin. But hey, now I know Tom Ley doesn't like Penn State, which is alright because Penn State is hated by lots of people. Again, I agree that Jay needs to go far away from this place, and I wish he fucking would. He was critical of the Franklin staff last year and it pissed me off to no end.


Does not really matter, they are a national outlet.

I grew up a Pitt fan, but I hate Penn St basically because of your Woody Allen analogy (hate him too).

You can say it is dead, but celebrating Paterno and electing his son to the board does not give that appearance to outsiders. That is the national view. Sorry I went with something I could find easy since I remember seeing it on twitter. Talk shows did the same. It is really not hard to find articles ridiculing Penn State for this.

PSU = school of a child molestor for many, and they continue to make moves to support this stance.
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#5284 User is offline   jcharding 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 04:46 PM

 Grey, on 11 May 2017 - 03:24 PM, said:

I don't quite get what you mean here. Not being sarcastic, just actually don't quite get it? I don't think anyone involved with the crime should be "absolved", but "Penn State" did not molest children. Jerry Sandusky molested children. That's his name on the court docket.

Now, there IS an analogy that I can make, that supports those of you who will continue to hate PSU for these cover ups, which I agree with: Take the example of Woody Allen. Woody Allen, I used to be a fan of his movies, but after I understood that he very likely was a child molester, I will not support his movies, and I do not like those in Hollywood who continue to kiss his ass about how great his work is, and how his "art should be separated from the person". Bullshit. So, in that way, I do see your points. Yes, I realize he was not convicted or arrested and there are those who believe he is innocent, I'm not one of them.


Just as the Catholic Church carries responsibility for the actions of its priests, so too does Penn State. Institutional responsibility. A Catholic nun in new Zealand carries with her the institutional stain just as surely as a 2017 PSU recruit carries the stain of Sandusky.

Similarly, the governments and employees of the governments of Japan and Germany carry with them the stains of WWII.

It also took a long time for the companies of Japan and Germany to get through their wartime involvement - and its not like a 40 year od 1980s employee had much to do with the actions of Carl Zeiss in 1944.

The responsible party isn't just Sandusky. Nor is it just Sandusky and Paterno and SPanier and ___. The responsible parties are Sandusky, Paterno, Spanier, ____ AND Penn State. And this entity based responsibility doesn't dissipate once the individual actors are gone. How long does it last? Beats me. Some WWII veterans refused to buy German or Japanese until the end of their days. Many still believe (as should be obvious at CIA) that the Catholic Church remains in their position of corporate/entity liability. PSU? For me, at least a decade, maybe longer. And I actually think that you have to give a lot of "credit" to Sandusky. Psychopaths and sociopaths are really really good at what they do; at exploiting the rest of us. But for me PSU carries a fairly significant entity based responsibility that the departures of Sandusky et al doesn't wipe away. I think the same thing about Baylor if it makes you feel any better. For me the institutional responsibilities were so egregiously violated that both schools would have gotten the Death Penalty from me, and I would have given it very little thought as for me they were both complete no brainers. No I didn't go to Pitt, or any PSU rival.
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Posted 11 May 2017 - 05:27 PM

 jcharding, on 11 May 2017 - 04:46 PM, said:

Just as the Catholic Church carries responsibility for the actions of its priests, so too does Penn State. Institutional responsibility. A Catholic nun in new Zealand carries with her the institutional stain just as surely as a 2017 PSU recruit carries the stain of Sandusky.

Similarly, the governments and employees of the governments of Japan and Germany carry with them the stains of WWII.

It also took a long time for the companies of Japan and Germany to get through their wartime involvement - and its not like a 40 year od 1980s employee had much to do with the actions of Carl Zeiss in 1944.

The responsible party isn't just Sandusky. Nor is it just Sandusky and Paterno and SPanier and ___. The responsible parties are Sandusky, Paterno, Spanier, ____ AND Penn State. And this entity based responsibility doesn't dissipate once the individual actors are gone. How long does it last? Beats me. Some WWII veterans refused to buy German or Japanese until the end of their days. Many still believe (as should be obvious at CIA) that the Catholic Church remains in their position of corporate/entity liability. PSU? For me, at least a decade, maybe longer. And I actually think that you have to give a lot of "credit" to Sandusky. Psychopaths and sociopaths are really really good at what they do; at exploiting the rest of us. But for me PSU carries a fairly significant entity based responsibility that the departures of Sandusky et al doesn't wipe away. I think the same thing about Baylor if it makes you feel any better. For me the institutional responsibilities were so egregiously violated that both schools would have gotten the Death Penalty from me, and I would have given it very little thought as for me they were both complete no brainers. No I didn't go to Pitt, or any PSU rival.


Wow. Just a bit of an exaggeration I think.

Sandusky molested those children, nobody else. Comparing the heinous acts of one monster, to a group of families, does not quite equal an entire government systematically torturing and murdering over 10 million people. I don't think the Germany comparison is accurate.


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#5286 User is offline   GoBucs21 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 05:30 PM

 Grey, on 11 May 2017 - 05:27 PM, said:

Wow. Just a bit of an exaggeration I think.

Sandusky molested those children, nobody else. Comparing the heinous acts of one monster, to a group of families, does not quite equal an entire government systematically torturing and murdering over 10 million people. I don't think the Germany comparison is accurate.

I think you're missing the point of the analogy. I lived in Germany in the mid and late 1980s. More than a few older Germans made a point of letting me know they weren't Nazis.
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#5287 User is offline   jcharding 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 06:23 PM

More examples....

University X has a very "helpful" teacher, who likes to give all athletes A's - even if they never go to class. NCAA discovers this, and informs school. School fires teacher. Now according to broken Sandusky-Penn State logic the matter is settled and done! Unsurprisingly, the NCAA disagrees and even though the teacher is gone the NCAA puts University X on probation. Lesson. Universities remain responsible for the actions of their employees and such long after they are gone, and the University will get penalized. Does it matter that a player who never even registered for the helpful teacher's class is harmed? Nope.

Fox News, run by Roger Ailes and crew, has a history of a hostile work environment and discriminatory sexual practices. Fox News, because this publicity sucks, fires Roger Ailes et al. Does this termination stop the lawsuits against Fox News? Nope. Can various state and federal governmental agencies punish Fox News even though Ailes and crew are gone? Yup.

It has always boggled my mind that so many PSU supporters just refuse to accept this basic concept of entity based liability and responsibility. And that disassociating with the primary employee offenders in no way prevents large and long term consequences.
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#5288 User is offline   Grey 

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 07:21 PM

 jcharding, on 11 May 2017 - 06:23 PM, said:

More examples....

University X has a very "helpful" teacher, who likes to give all athletes A's - even if they never go to class. NCAA discovers this, and informs school. School fires teacher. Now according to broken Sandusky-Penn State logic the matter is settled and done! Unsurprisingly, the NCAA disagrees and even though the teacher is gone the NCAA puts University X on probation. Lesson. Universities remain responsible for the actions of their employees and such long after they are gone, and the University will get penalized. Does it matter that a player who never even registered for the helpful teacher's class is harmed? Nope.

Fox News, run by Roger Ailes and crew, has a history of a hostile work environment and discriminatory sexual practices. Fox News, because this publicity sucks, fires Roger Ailes et al. Does this termination stop the lawsuits against Fox News? Nope. Can various state and federal governmental agencies punish Fox News even though Ailes and crew are gone? Yup.

It has always boggled my mind that so many PSU supporters just refuse to accept this basic concept of entity based liability and responsibility. And that disassociating with the primary employee offenders in no way prevents large and long term consequences.


Analogy is solid. I get what you mean now.

For me, it's over though. I'm going to support my team on the field and my coach on the field and my players on the roster. None of them have anything to do with this. National perception, may in fact be what you say it is, which is unfortunate, but as for myself and everyone I personally know, we hate chomos, we hate the people involved in this, and WE are Penn State.
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#5289 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

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Posted 12 May 2017 - 01:58 PM

View PostGrey, on 11 May 2017 - 05:27 PM, said:

Wow. Just a bit of an exaggeration I think.

Sandusky molested those children, nobody else. Comparing the heinous acts of one monster, to a group of families, does not quite equal an entire government systematically torturing and murdering over 10 million people. I don't think the Germany comparison is accurate.


True, he was the only one that molested the children, but he was not the only one responsible. People knew and let it continue.

I will never understand why they let that guy stick around after multiple accusations. Or after the grand jury evidence was known. How could Paterno allow Sandusky to keep using his facilities knowing all of that?

I do not blame you for rooting for your school, or anything...but some people there clearly do not get it. Jay Paterno, Franco Harris, and some others are very vocal about their stupidity.
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Posted 13 May 2017 - 06:18 AM

At least I can excuse Jay Paterno to a certain extent. He is defending the reputation of his father. He is wrong. But I get it.

The rest of the pro-molestation group at Penn State -- Including Franco and seemingly most fans -- are the ones who make me sick.
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Posted 25 May 2017 - 02:09 PM

This letter appeared in today's PG:

Quote

Rob Rogers' Penn State cartoon was ill informed

12:00 AM MAY 25, 2017
I view Rob Rogers’ editorial cartoons each morning not because I agree with even a few of his viewpoints. Instead, I view them because they have an incredible ability to keep my blood pressure from dropping to unsafe levels. Most recent case in point: his attempt on May 22 to link the tragic death of a student at a Penn State fraternity with the Jerry Sandusky issue.

Perhaps Mr. Rogers and his readers would have been better served if he had first done some research on the nationwide epidemic of such deaths as he would have found that such tragedies are clearly not confined to Penn State.

Additionally, I would recommend that he and others in the media actually take the time to read the Freeh Report and then Dick Thornburgh’s very critical analysis of it. Perhaps then their conclusions regarding the manner in which former Penn State administrators — including football coach Joe Paterno and president Graham Spanier — handled the entire Sandusky issue would be based on facts and context and not senationalism and generalization.

VAUGHN GILBERT
Elizabeth Township

The writer is a member of the advisory board at Penn State’s Greater Allegheny Campus.


It was in response to this cartoon:
Posted Image


Ah, still missing the point of the sanctions against Penn State I see.

the content of the letter:
(1) linking the tragedy to the Sandusky issue was what the cartoon did (it didn't, it was a comment on PSUs handling of the publicity)
(2) other schools have hazing tragedies (and? so? does that make it less awful? does taht absolve Penn State of any responsibility?)
(3) media has uninformed (surely they did not read the bad Freeh report and the good Thornburg report!) and bad conclusion about administration handling it (I'm sure this doesn't need further response. Go JoPa!)
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Posted 25 May 2017 - 05:15 PM

View Postoblongatta, on 25 May 2017 - 02:09 PM, said:

This letter appeared in today's PG:


It was in response to this cartoon:
Posted Image


Ah, still missing the point of the sanctions against Penn State I see.

the content of the letter:
(1) linking the tragedy to the Sandusky issue was what the cartoon did (it didn't, it was a comment on PSUs handling of the publicity)
(2) other schools have hazing tragedies (and? so? does that make it less awful? does taht absolve Penn State of any responsibility?)
(3) media has uninformed (surely they did not read the bad Freeh report and the good Thornburg report!) and bad conclusion about administration handling it (I'm sure this doesn't need further response. Go JoPa!)

Joe has been dead and gone for more than five years.
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#5293 User is offline   NCBuccofan 

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Posted Yesterday, 01:58 PM

View Postoblongatta, on 25 May 2017 - 02:09 PM, said:

This letter appeared in today's PG:


It was in response to this cartoon:
Posted Image


Ah, still missing the point of the sanctions against Penn State I see.

the content of the letter:
(1) linking the tragedy to the Sandusky issue was what the cartoon did (it didn't, it was a comment on PSUs handling of the publicity)
(2) other schools have hazing tragedies (and? so? does that make it less awful? does taht absolve Penn State of any responsibility?)
(3) media has uninformed (surely they did not read the bad Freeh report and the good Thornburg report!) and bad conclusion about administration handling it (I'm sure this doesn't need further response. Go JoPa!)



Reminds me of how UNC fans excuse their cheating scandal. Well University of X is going it, so there.

I get that many Penn St fans thing that guy is an idiot, but he is in a position to represent the school, just like that senile board member...and now Jay paterno. I guarantee this guy wants JoePas statue back up.
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Posted Yesterday, 05:46 PM

UNC is not going on probation. The NCAA, in 2017, is toothless and powerless.
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