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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:15 PM
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A grand slam, of course it doesn't count because it came in the last week of September and not October.

151 RBI now


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Martini
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:19 PM
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Means nothing. Still not a True Yankee.


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:21 PM
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150/151 of those RBI are not as important as 50 of Jeters


or something


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Legion Stats (58 at bats):
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Martini
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:24 PM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 25 2007, 09:21 PM)
150/151 of those RBI are not as important as 50 of Jeters

Not even close.


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AltimusPrime
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:29 PM
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Arod's RBIs are stupid. Jeter's rule.
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LeftyJR
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 09:34 PM
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But he's not the "captain" of the team - doesn't count.


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Ma13tt0
Posted: Sep 25 2007, 10:40 PM
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Jeter's rbis could beat 151/69 Arod Rbis two years ago.


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 07:56 AM
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You do realize that rooting for a team that makes the playoffs every year is different than rooting for a last place team, right?

Losing in the first round to the Yankees is like finising in last place.

Postseason Career:

Derek Jeter: .314/.384/.479/.863 (119 G)
Alex Rodriguez: .280/.362/.485/.847 (35 G)
ARod as Yankee: .241/.341/.430/.771 (20 G)

Now do you see why Yankee fans are still a bit suspect of Alex Rodriguez? It doesn't matter what he does between April and September, if he can't help get this team past the first round, then the season is a failure.







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7bucs
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 08:29 AM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 07:56 AM)
Losing in the first round to the Yankees is like finising in last place. 

What, exactly, is it considered when they don't even make it to the post season?

Arod is about to put the Yankees in the playoffs this year. It sure is nice of Jeter to have been 'average' since July in a pennant race...


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jeffr92
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 08:35 AM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 07:56 AM)
You do realize that rooting for a team that makes the playoffs every year is different than rooting for a last place team, right?

Losing in the first round to the Yankees is like finising in last place.

Postseason Career:

Derek Jeter: .314/.384/.479/.863 (119 G)
Alex Rodriguez: .280/.362/.485/.847 (35 G)
ARod as Yankee: .241/.341/.430/.771 (20 G)

Now do you see why Yankee fans are still a bit suspect of Alex Rodriguez? It doesn't matter what he does between April and September, if he can't help get this team past the first round, then the season is a failure.

Actually Postseason Career for A-Rod:

35G .280/.362/.485/.847
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7bucs
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 08:37 AM
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QUOTE (jeffr92 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:35 AM)
Actually Postseason Career for A-Rod:

35G .280/.362/.485/.847

The 'Arod as a Yankee' bit suited the argument...


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"You don't like to trade a player like Ramirez who has come up through their system and performed like he did, but we need better talent and more financial flexibility,'' Littlefield said. "We need a lot more players to help us get to where we want to be.''

"Every great batter works on the theory that the pitcher is more afraid of him than he is of the pitcher."
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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 09:55 AM
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Of course without A-Rod the Yankees would be 110-52 this year right?


Idiot


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Legion Stats (58 at bats):
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 09:59 AM
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QUOTE (7bucs @ Sep 26 2007, 07:37 AM)
QUOTE (jeffr92 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:35 AM)
Actually Postseason Career for A-Rod:

35G .280/.362/.485/.847

The 'Arod as a Yankee' bit suited the argument...

well, yes, it suited the argument because Yankee fans cheer for ARod as a Yankee, they could care less about what he did in Seattle in the 90's.

and Jeff, you do realize that Alex Rodriguez and ARod are the same person, don't you?

and 7bucs, when was the last time the Yankees didn't make the playoffs?

1993... so yea, that is an entire generation of fans who don't know what it is when the Yankees don't make the playoffs.



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 10:03 AM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:55 AM)
Of course without A-Rod the Yankees would be 110-52 this year right?


Idiot

you're such a dipshit. nobody said anything like that.

fact is, Arod has sucked in the playoffs as a Yankee, and considering he is the highest paid player in the game, he should be expected to produce.

.771 OPS in his 20 playoffs games as a Yankee are not producing.



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7bucs
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 10:08 AM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:59 AM)
and 7bucs, when was the last time the Yankees didn't make the playoffs?

2007, if it wasn't for Arod. Where has your boy Jetah been since July? Someone may want to wake him up for a pennant race...


--------------------
"You don't like to trade a player like Ramirez who has come up through their system and performed like he did, but we need better talent and more financial flexibility,'' Littlefield said. "We need a lot more players to help us get to where we want to be.''

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monarch0
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 10:10 AM
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Jeter has OPSed .768 Post ASB, in the middle of a pennant race. True Yankee.

Arod has OPSed 1.029 in that time frame. CANCER. REASON THEY SUCK.


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 10:13 AM
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QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:10 AM)
Jeter has OPSed .768 Post ASB, in the middle of a pennant race. True Yankee.

Arod has OPSed 1.029 in that time frame. CANCER. REASON THEY SUCK.

It doesn't matter what you do in the regular season, its all irrelevant.


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CENTRAL PA ATHLETE OF THE WEEK 5/26
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Legion Stats (58 at bats):
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:19 AM
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QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:10 AM)
Jeter has 4 World Championship Rings.  True Yankee.

Arod has OPSed .771 in the playoffs as a Yankee.  Still Must Prove Himself in the PLAYOFFS.


Fixed


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:21 AM
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Wow, who knew a baseball game can be played and won by one person.

I had no idea.

You sound like a fucking whiny Yankme fan, or the NY Post


--------------------
FIRST TEAM CPL
CENTRAL PA ATHLETE OF THE WEEK 5/26
Casey Zimmerman, Jr., CF, Lewistown High
.392/.492/.824/1.316 (52 at bats)
Legion Stats (58 at bats):
.328/.412/.534/.946
5-2B
2-3B
1-HR
13-R
10-RBI
8-BB
8-K
2-SB
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:23 AM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:13 AM)
QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:10 AM)
Jeter has OPSed .768 Post ASB, in the middle of a pennant race.  True Yankee.

Arod has OPSed 1.029 in that time frame.  CANCER.  REASON THEY SUCK.

It doesn't matter what you do in the regular season, its all irrelevant.

Just because the Pirates suck doesn't mean everybody else in the league has to view getting to 75 wins as a major accomplishment.

The Yankees are in the playoffs every year. Their fans expect a little more than a .771 OPS in the playoffs from the highest paid player in the game.



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:32 AM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:21 AM)
Wow, who knew a baseball game can be played and won by one person.

I had no idea.

You sound like a fucking whiny Yankme fan, or the NY Post

And you sound like the douchebag that you are.

Care to guess what these numbers represent:

.405/.436/.757/1.193
.103/.257/.138/.395



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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:35 AM
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No, don't really care.

A-Rod is the best player in baseball this season and the douchebags in the Bronx continue to bitch about him because he isn't Derek Jeter.


Media and fans included, get the fuck over it. I hate the Yankees, I hope A-rod hits .700 this post-season, the Yanks lose, they still bitch about him and he tells them all to go fuck themselves and leaves.


--------------------
FIRST TEAM CPL
CENTRAL PA ATHLETE OF THE WEEK 5/26
Casey Zimmerman, Jr., CF, Lewistown High
.392/.492/.824/1.316 (52 at bats)
Legion Stats (58 at bats):
.328/.412/.534/.946
5-2B
2-3B
1-HR
13-R
10-RBI
8-BB
8-K
2-SB
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LeftyJR
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:39 AM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:35 AM)
No, don't really care.

A-Rod is the best player in baseball this season and the douchebags in the Bronx continue to bitch about him because he isn't Derek Jeter.


Media and fans included, get the fuck over it. I hate the Yankees, I hope A-rod hits .700 this post-season, the Yanks lose, they still bitch about him and he tells them all to go fuck themselves and leaves.

I have to agree - AROD is the best player today (maybe ever). I'd take him on the Buccos in a second.


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:45 AM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:35 AM)
No, don't really care.

A-Rod is the best player in baseball this season and the douchebags in the Bronx continue to bitch about him because he isn't Derek Jeter.


Media and fans included, get the fuck over it. I hate the Yankees, I hope A-rod hits .700 this post-season, the Yanks lose, they still bitch about him and he tells them all to go fuck themselves and leaves.

Derek Jeter the last two postseasons vs Alex Rodriguez the last two.

If Superman could have mustered an RBI or 2, maybe they wouldn't have gone home in the first round the past two years.

Jeter: 15-37, 4 2B, 3 HR, 6 RBI, 2 BB, 8 R
ARod: 3-29, 1 2B, 0 HR, 0 RBI, 6 BB, 2 R

That right there, along with the 4 rings and the clutch hitting is why NYY fans love Derek Jeter and still are hoping for ARod to show up in October.

If Alex Rodriguez would have hit .700 in the previous postseasons, there would be no bitching from the fans or media. Its shit like 0 RBI's the past two years that cause the bitching.

Just like you bitch about Jason Bay every fucking at bat this year when he posted an OPS of over 900 the past 3 years, and bitched about every walk Ian Snell and Tom Gorzellany allowed, even though they were 2 of the better pitchers in the NL this year.


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LeftyJR
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:56 AM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:45 AM)
QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:35 AM)
No, don't really care.

A-Rod is the best player in baseball this season and the douchebags in the Bronx continue to bitch about him because he isn't Derek Jeter.


Media and fans included, get the fuck over it.  I hate the Yankees, I hope A-rod hits .700 this post-season, the Yanks lose, they still bitch about him and he tells them all to go fuck themselves and leaves.

Derek Jeter the last two postseasons vs Alex Rodriguez the last two.

If Superman could have mustered an RBI or 2, maybe they wouldn't have gone home in the first round the past two years.

Jeter: 15-37, 4 2B, 3 HR, 6 RBI, 2 BB, 8 R
ARod: 3-29, 1 2B, 0 HR, 0 RBI, 6 BB, 2 R

That right there, along with the 4 rings and the clutch hitting is why NYY fans love Derek Jeter and still are hoping for ARod to show up in October.

If Alex Rodriguez would have hit .700 in the previous postseasons, there would be no bitching from the fans or media. Its shit like 0 RBI's the past two years that cause the bitching.

Just like you bitch about Jason Bay every fucking at bat this year when he posted an OPS of over 900 the past 3 years, and bitched about every walk Ian Snell and Tom Gorzellany allowed, even though they were 2 of the better pitchers in the NL this year.

As an outside, I suppose it is easy for us to bash NY fans...


But we did the same to Bonds while he was here. We still boo him for that (more than we do for steriods).



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buccosmfg
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 11:59 AM
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QUOTE (LeftyJR @ Sep 26 2007, 11:56 AM)
But we did the same to Bonds while he was here. We still boo him for that (more than we do for steriods).

Bonds did steroids?


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penguin8334
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:00 PM
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QUOTE (buccosmfg @ Sep 26 2007, 08:59 AM)
Bonds did steroids?

Bonds played in Pittsburgh?
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Jeff King
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:01 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:00 AM)
QUOTE (buccosmfg @ Sep 26 2007, 08:59 AM)
Bonds did steroids?

Bonds played in Pittsburgh?

Bobby Bonds has a son?


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:08 PM
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I so really and truly hope ARod wins the MVP and the World Series and issues a public "Fuck you" to every arrogant, spoiled, Jeter-loving Yankee fan out there on his way out the door. Too bad those whores can out-spend their own assiness.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:14 PM
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The Angels are going to be awesome with A-rod and Bonds next season.


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penguin8334
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:15 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 09:14 AM)
The Angels are going to be awesome with A-rod and Bonds next season.

But based on what I've read in this thread, only until they reach the post season.
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:25 PM
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QUOTE
arrogant, spoiled, Jeter-loving Yankee fan


Clearly, baseball has become more of a computer game where the only thing that matters is regular season numbers rather than a sport where fans cheer for their team to win championships and the players that produce the championships.

Is Alex Rodriguez the best player in baseball? Yes.
Does this mean that the fans have to love him even though he hasn't done shit to help them win in the playoffs? No.



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jeffr92
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:26 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:59 AM)
QUOTE (7bucs @ Sep 26 2007, 07:37 AM)
QUOTE (jeffr92 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:35 AM)
Actually Postseason Career for A-Rod:

35G .280/.362/.485/.847

The 'Arod as a Yankee' bit suited the argument...

well, yes, it suited the argument because Yankee fans cheer for ARod as a Yankee, they could care less about what he did in Seattle in the 90's.

and Jeff, you do realize that Alex Rodriguez and ARod are the same person, don't you?

and 7bucs, when was the last time the Yankees didn't make the playoffs?

1993... so yea, that is an entire generation of fans who don't know what it is when the Yankees don't make the playoffs.

my fault, i skimmed and didn't see the "as a yankee" part. Regardless, bashing him for postseason mediocrity is absurd. Maybe if he wasn't constantly scrutinized beyond a reasonable level, he would have found more immediate success. He has not done anything to that city to make him the outcast that he is. He moved to thirdbase in favor of a far inferior defensive SS, because he was their golden boy.

Where's the outcry for Posada's mediocre postseason statistics?
.241/.358/.388/.746
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Jeff King
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:26 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 08:25 AM)
Is Alex Rodriguez the best player in baseball?

Yes.

Does this mean that the fans have to love him even though he hasn't done shit to help them win in the playoffs?

No.

MVK=Jim Tracy?


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monarch0
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:27 PM
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Posada is a True Yankee though, his postseason stats don't matter.


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:29 PM
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Stats only matter and can be used only in a context to prove ones point. Regardless of overall numbers or bigger sample sizes.


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buccosmfg
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:34 PM
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Derek Jeter could beat 10/11 Big Ten teams in a bowl game


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herrmorpheus
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:39 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:23 AM)
The Yankees are in the playoffs every year. Their fans expect a little more than a .771 OPS in the playoffs from the highest paid player in the game.

Then the Yankees fans should expect a little more out of the following players besides A-Rod in the postseason:

Johnny Damon - .690 OPS in 2006 playoffs
Hideki Matsui - .563 OPS in 2006 playoffs, .673 OPS in 2005 playoffs
Robinson Cano - .267 OPS in 2006 playoffs, .754 OPS in 2005 playoffs

And that's just the lineup. That says nothing about Randy Johnson and Mike Mussina having ERAs in the stratosphere the past two years, of Jaret Wright, Tanyon Sturze, and Corey Lidle having ERAs in the DOUBLE DIGITS.

No, A-Rod is the only problem...


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:41 PM
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Posada isn't the best player in baseball and isn't making over $25M to produce offense.

QUOTE
Stats only matter and can be used only in a context to prove ones point. Regardless of overall numbers or bigger sample sizes.


Maybe if he drove in a couple of runs and OPS'd more than .350 the past two postseasons, he would have a larger sample size.



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:44 PM
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QUOTE (herrmorpheus @ Sep 26 2007, 11:39 AM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:23 AM)
The Yankees are in the playoffs every year.  Their fans expect a little more than a .771 OPS in the playoffs from the highest paid player in the game.

Then the Yankees fans should expect a little more out of the following players besides A-Rod in the postseason:

Johnny Damon - .690 OPS in 2006 playoffs
Hideki Matsui - .563 OPS in 2006 playoffs, .673 OPS in 2005 playoffs
Robinson Cano - .267 OPS in 2006 playoffs, .754 OPS in 2005 playoffs

And that's just the lineup. That says nothing about Randy Johnson and Mike Mussina having ERAs in the stratosphere the past two years, of Jaret Wright, Tanyon Sturze, and Corey Lidle having ERAs in the DOUBLE DIGITS.

No, A-Rod is the only problem...

those guys aren't the highest paid player in history, and aren't considered the best player in the game.

and all of those players were scrutinized, just not to the level of ARod, whose OPS was about .350 the past two years combined. He sucked much worse than any of those players, and makes a whole hell of alot more. He is expected to be good.

as someone said earlier, Bonds is chastised by everyone in this city for not coming through in the playoffs when he was the MVP twice (should have been all three years), but ARod is given a free pass by all of you, while you call out the NYY fans and media.

hypocrites.


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penguin8334
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:45 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:25 AM)
Is Alex Rodriguez the best player in baseball? Yes.
Does this mean that the fans have to love him even though he hasn't done shit to help them win in the playoffs? No.

So I guess the Red Sox shouldn't love Ted Williams.

And Astro fans shouldn't love Jeff Bagwell.

And Indian fans should hate Jim Thome.

And White Sox and A's fans should hate Frank Thomas.
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:47 PM
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QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:27 AM)
Posada is a True Yankee though, his postseason stats don't matter.

by the way, Posada's OPS the past two playoffs:

2005 - 1.012
2006 - 1.349



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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:48 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 12:47 PM)
QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:27 AM)
Posada is a True Yankee though, his postseason stats don't matter.

by the way, Posada's OPS the past two playoffs:

2005 - 1.012
2006 - 1.349

So the other ones don't count?

Cool


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penguin8334
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:49 PM
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Why does mvk get to pick which stats to support his argument and which to ignore?
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:51 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:45 AM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 09:25 AM)
Is Alex Rodriguez the best player in baseball?  Yes. 
Does this mean that the fans have to love him even though he hasn't done shit to help them win in the playoffs?  No.

So I guess the Red Sox shouldn't love Ted Williams.

And Astro fans shouldn't love Jeff Bagwell.

And Indian fans should hate Jim Thome.

And White Sox and A's fans should hate Frank Thomas.

I never said anything about those other teams, its not them that everyone is blasting.

But now that you mention it, Thomas and Thome did pretty well in the playoffs when they made it.



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 12:56 PM
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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:48 AM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 12:47 PM)
QUOTE (monarch0 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:27 AM)
Posada is a True Yankee though, his postseason stats don't matter.

by the way, Posada's OPS the past two playoffs:

2005 - 1.012
2006 - 1.349

So the other ones don't count?

Cool

Posada's OPS in the postseason is 30 points lower than ARod's over the course of his career.

ARod is the best player in baseball, don't you think he should be a bit higher than .771?


Posada's postseason vs regular season

.746/.859 = 87 OPS+ against his regular season

ARod's

.771/.966 = 79 OPS+ against his regular season

Posada is much closer to performing as he normally does.

Derek Jeter

.863/.849 = 102 OPS+ against his regular season



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:06 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:49 AM)
Why does Herm get to pick which stats to support his argument and which to ignore?

Fixed


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DoctorJohnnyFever
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:14 PM
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This thread is making my head hurt.

Should Buffalo fans love Jim kelly, Thurman Thomas and Andre Reed? Or should they RUN THEM OUT OF TOWN!!!!!


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:15 PM
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According to MVK - Run them out of town


Which apparently is what should have been done to pre-06/07 Peyton Manning as well


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:25 PM
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I know this a living in a dreamworld, but do all that you can to imagine that the Pirates would make the playoffs. I know it is tough, but see if you can do it.

Now imagine Jason Bay at the plate with runners on second and third and 2 outs, the Pirates down 4-3.

You don't have to imagine Jason Bay watching a called third strike on a 1-2 count, because that is what he always does.

What would Zimm's reaction to this be?

I'm sure he would be supporting Jason Bay as he always does in these situations.

Now think back to 1990, 1991, or 1992 when Barry Bonds was in the same type of situation and flied out to shallow left field or grounded out to second base. How did you react? I'm sure a polite golf clap followed by a "Oh well, he was great in the regular season" was all that was said, right?

Zimm gets pissed about Jason Bay sucking for a team that loses 90+ games every year, his head would explode if Bay had an OPS of .350 in a playoff series.

Or he would drink a bottle of Captain and pass out by 9:45.



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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:27 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 12:14 PM)
This thread is making my head hurt.

Should Buffalo fans love Jim kelly, Thurman Thomas and Andre Reed? Or should they RUN THEM OUT OF TOWN!!!!!

none of them sucked to the level that ARod has sucked in the postseason.


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:30 PM
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Yet all of them won the same amount of championships as A-Rod had.


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:35 PM
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Arod isn't criticized because he doesn't have a championship, he is criticized because he has sucked in the postseason.

Obviously you don't understand this, and you never will.


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penguin8334
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:36 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:27 AM)
QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 12:14 PM)
This thread is making my head hurt.

Should Buffalo fans love Jim kelly, Thurman Thomas and Andre Reed? Or should they RUN THEM OUT OF TOWN!!!!!

none of them sucked to the level that ARod has sucked in the postseason.

Really? I realize comparing football stats to baseball stats is apples and oranges, but Thurman Thomas rushed for 69 yards in his last three Superbowls. And missed the first series of one because he forgot his helmet.
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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:40 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 12:36 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:27 AM)
QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 12:14 PM)
This thread is making my head hurt.

Should Buffalo fans love Jim kelly, Thurman Thomas and Andre Reed? Or should they RUN THEM OUT OF TOWN!!!!!

none of them sucked to the level that ARod has sucked in the postseason.

Really? I realize comparing football stats to baseball stats is apples and oranges, but Thurman Thomas rushed for 69 yards in his last three Superbowls. And missed the first series of one because he forgot his helmet.

a bit tough to get the running game going when you get down early (as was the case in the games against the redskins and the first cowboys game). i think it was the third one that he lost his helmet, and he didnt do that great, 16 carries for 37 yards with a TD, but he did have 7 catches for 52 yards as well.



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buccosmfg
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 01:55 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:40 PM)
i think it was the third one that he lost his helmet, and he didnt do that great, 16 carries for 37 yards with a TD, but he did have 7 catches for 52 yards as well.

Reggie Bush does that and we see it for 7 days staright on ESPN


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:10 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 12:14 PM)
This thread is making my head hurt.

Yea, I want my money back.

BTW, mzimm as a poster >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>mvk.

Just read any post above. Case closed.

mvk must now rub mzimms little helmet. Punishment decreed.


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:17 PM
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BOO HOO FUCKING HOO

MVK wants players to perform in the playoffs, not mediocre or worse performances when it counts most.

Funny, but I seem to remember Zimm motherfucking Moronelli up and down this past weekend because he sucked against Michigan. That was a game that mattered a whole helluva lot more than FIU or Buffalo, wasn't it? Michigan, Wisconsin, and Ohio State are defacto playoff games in the Big Ten for Penn State, because if you don't win those games, you have no shot at a championship, or a BCS game.

Fitting that regular season is all that matters around here, I mean, there is no fucking hope for the Pirates ever getting to the postseason, so I guess 75 wins really would be the summit.



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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:19 PM
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mvk posts too much


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:19 PM
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Morelli has sucked in every game....


as a matter of fact the only game Morelli hasn't looked like shit in was the Bowl Game last year which coincidentally is the "playoffs".


Not sure how he relates to A-Rod, A-Rod is really good all the time, Morelli is never any good, I never liked him as a QB and never will.


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mvk112
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:21 PM
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QUOTE
A-Rod is really good all the time


except in the playoffs.

and a bowl game is not the playoffs, unless you are in the national championship game. the bowl game was their last game, win or lose.


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mzimmerman81
Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:23 PM
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The reason why I put "playoffs" in quotes when referring to the Bowl Game is just that. It's not just another game as you say, it is the last game, but its a Bowl Game, one that to alot of teams is the goal to make it to one, some bigger than others.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:25 PM
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QUOTE (buccosmfg @ Sep 26 2007, 01:19 PM)
mvk posts too much

mvk is LIC on crack.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:28 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:44 AM)

as someone said earlier, Bonds is chastised by everyone in this city for not coming through in the playoffs when he was the MVP twice (should have been all three years), but ARod is given a free pass by all of you, while you call out the NYY fans and media.

hypocrites.

well that's a broad brush you're using there. Not all of us blamed Bonds as being unclutch. and for the record, clutch in baseball and clutch in football are two different things.

The bottom line is that these are all small sample sizes, it doesn't mean Bonds then or ARod now are not clutch.

And as for not coming through in the playoffs, in neither case was it because the player wasn't trying or because he didn't perform up to his abilites. Both players simply had (a) bad series against a set of pitchers that played a great game and handled them unlike most pitchers throughout the season.

I still think it's absurde that the media makes it out to be an ARod versus Jeter thing.

As for right now, I'm just hoping that the Yankees can make up the 2 games and pass the Red Sux.

I'm also willing to bet that ARod will have a better OPS in this year's post-season than will Jeter.
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:29 PM
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In this thread mvk has:

- Ignored Arod's playoff #'s as a Mariner because they don't support his argument.

- Ignored the fact the sample size of ARod's post season numbers as a Yankee are small.

- Ignored the fact ARod hasn't been the only Yankee to struggle in the playoffs during the last three seasons.

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in the history of baseball to struggle in the playoffs.

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in the history of professional football to struggle in the playoffs

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in history of college football to struggle in the playoffs.


Did I miss anything?
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:35 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:29 PM)
In this thread mvk has:

- Ignored Arod's playoff #'s as a Mariner because they don't support his argument.

- Ignored the fact the sample size of ARod's post season numbers as a Yankee are small.

- Ignored the fact ARod hasn't been the only Yankee to struggle in the playoffs during the last three seasons.

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in the history of baseball to struggle in the playoffs.

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in the history of professional football to struggle in the playoffs

- Ignored the fact ARod isn't the only superstar in history of college football to struggle in the playoffs.


Did I miss anything?

- The argument was that Yankee fans don't support ARod because he doesn't come through in the playoffs. Why the hell would Yankee fans care about what he did as a Mariner 8-10 years ago?

- Again, it doesn't change the fact that he sucked in his Yankee playoff performances.

- The rest of the players aren't considered the best player in the game. And nobody has stuggled to the extent he has in comparison to his regular season numbers.

- I never ignored this, actually I used Barry Bonds as a reference point after someone else initially brought it up.

- I don't know why the hell football was ever even brought up, because baseball is a much more individual performance sport when compared to football, especially a running back.

- Just about everyone here has criticized Jason Bay this year at one point or another. Isn't his terrible 2/3 of a season a small sample size compared to his entire career of 900+ OPS?


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:36 PM
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A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:38 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 02:36 PM)
A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.

Yeah, only when you give credit to his numbers while a Mariner. Everyone knows baseball outside of pinstripes is equivalent to minor league ball.
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:38 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 01:36 PM)
A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.

hmmm... care to back that up in any way possible?

it wouldn't be in the form of postseason OPS, because Jeter is at .863 compared to ARod's .847


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:40 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:17 AM)
MVK wants players to perform in the playoffs, not mediocre or worse performances when it counts most.


MVK referring to himself in the 3rd person. Sup wit dat?


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:41 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:38 AM)
QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 01:36 PM)
A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.

hmmm... care to back that up in any way possible?

it wouldn't be in the form of postseason OPS, because Jeter is at .863 compared to ARod's .847

I take this as a moral victory since it's the first time mvk has admitted ARod played in the post season prior to 2004.
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:43 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:41 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:38 AM)
QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 01:36 PM)
A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.

hmmm... care to back that up in any way possible?

it wouldn't be in the form of postseason OPS, because Jeter is at .863 compared to ARod's .847

I take this as a moral victory since it's the first time mvk has admitted ARod played in the post season prior to 2004.

him playing in the postseason prior to 2004 has nothing to do with the original conversation, which is why Yankee fans are hard on him for not performing in the playoffs.

again, nobody has ever answered why Yankee fans would give a shit about what he did as a Mariner 8-10 years ago.

does anybody around here except monarch really care about what matt morris did as a st. louis cardinal?


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:46 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 10:43 AM)
does anybody around here except monarch really care about what matt morris did as a st. louis cardinal?

Dave Littlefield.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:48 PM
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If it weren't for Alex Rodriguez winning MVP's and hitting 53 home runs a season they'd have no playoffs to bitch about...


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:49 PM
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QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 02:48 PM)
If it weren't for Alex Rodriguez winning MVP's and hitting 53 home runs a season they'd have no playoffs to bitch about...

ding ding ding


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:49 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:43 AM)
him playing in the postseason prior to 2004 has nothing to do with the original conversation, which is why Yankee fans are hard on him for not performing in the playoffs.

again, nobody has ever answered why Yankee fans would give a shit about what he did as a Mariner 8-10 years ago.

does anybody around here except monarch really care about what matt morris did as a st. louis cardinal?

So you attribute ARod's decline in post season production to a decline in talent much like we've seen in Matt Morris?

And the reason Yankee fans and everyone should care about what ARod did as a Mariner in the playoff is because the sample size as a Yankee is too small. Don't you get that?
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who cares about the guy actually getting them to the playoffs, thats unimportant. Yankee fans realize they would make it this year without him.

If he wasn't playing Jeter would have hit 30 HRs and OPSed .950, he realized they aren't needed this season since they have A-Rod.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:51 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:49 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:43 AM)
him playing in the postseason prior to 2004 has nothing to do with the original conversation, which is why Yankee fans are hard on him for not performing in the playoffs.

again, nobody has ever answered why Yankee fans would give a shit about what he did as a Mariner 8-10 years ago.

does anybody around here except monarch really care about what matt morris did as a st. louis cardinal?

So you attribute ARod's decline in post season production to a deline in talent much like we've seen in Matt Morris?

And the reason Yankee fans and everyone should care about what ARod did as a Mariner in the playoff is because the sample size as a Yankee is too small. Don't you get that?

no i never said ARod had a decline in talent. its just that why would they care about what he did for some other team? he isn't getting the job done in the playoffs.

and if they didn't have ARod, its not like they would have Matt Kata playing third base, so who knows if they would be near the playoffs or not.

certainly they would have been in the playoffs last year, and he shit the bed big time once they got there.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:53 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 02:43 PM)
QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:41 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:38 AM)
QUOTE (DoctorJohnnyFever @ Sep 26 2007, 01:36 PM)
A-rod has better career Post-season numbers than Jeter.

Fact.

hmmm... care to back that up in any way possible?

it wouldn't be in the form of postseason OPS, because Jeter is at .863 compared to ARod's .847

I take this as a moral victory since it's the first time mvk has admitted ARod played in the post season prior to 2004.

him playing in the postseason prior to 2004 has nothing to do with the original conversation, which is why Yankee fans are hard on him for not performing in the playoffs.

again, nobody has ever answered why Yankee fans would give a shit about what he did as a Mariner 8-10 years ago.

does anybody around here except monarch really care about what matt morris did as a st. louis cardinal?

He's had a grand total of 79 at bats as a Yankee in the playoffs. 50 of those came in 2004 and he put up these numbers:
.320/.413/.600/1.013

So you're crucifying the guy over 29 fucking atbats between 2005 and 2006 playoffs
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And none of the other Yankees shit the bed...,..


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:55 PM
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:51 AM)
he isn't getting the job done in the playoffs.


Do you realize you're basing this on 29 AB's?

29.

Why are you ignoring the previous 50 AB's where he posted a OPS above 1.000?

Edit: Jeff beat me to the punch.
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:55 PM
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The reason people are arguing about small sample size is if ARod goes 3/4 with a HR and a BB in the first game of the playoffs he basically doubles his postseason OPS as a Yankee. If he does it 2 games in a rowhe and Jeter are neck and neck. Now the odds of the guy going 3/4 with a HR in each game are extreme based on his performance this year, but it could happen.


edit: - without checking myself I was basing this on the numbers earlier in the thread which left out the 2004 season - whoops - for the record, my example of 3/4 with a BB and a HR would jump his Yankee OPS .080


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QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:50 PM)
who cares about the guy actually getting them to the playoffs, thats unimportant. Yankee fans realize they would make it this year without him.

If he wasn't playing Jeter would have hit 30 HRs and OPSed .950, he realized they aren't needed this season since they have A-Rod.

the level of hate you have for derek jeter is insane.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 02:57 PM
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QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:55 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:51 AM)
he isn't getting the job done in the playoffs.


Do you realize you're basing this on 29 AB's?

29.

how many playoff at bats do you think most major league players get over the course of their careers?


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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:57 AM)
how many playoff at bats do you think most major league players get over the course of their careers?

I have no idea, but ARod has 132. Why are you ignoring 103 of them?
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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 02:55 PM)
QUOTE (mzimmerman81 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:50 PM)
who cares about the guy actually getting them to the playoffs, thats unimportant.  Yankee fans realize they would make it this year without him.

If he wasn't playing Jeter would have hit 30 HRs and OPSed .950, he realized they aren't needed this season since they have A-Rod.

the level of hate you have for derek jeter is insane.

No its the fact that Yankme fans seem to think he is 100x better than Arod, when he isn't.

The fact that A-rod was forced to move from his natural position for Jetah and did so.

It's just ridiculous, maybe if A-rod leaps into the stands and makes a catch in the playoffs, they will lay off.


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QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 02:57 PM)
QUOTE (penguin8334 @ Sep 26 2007, 01:55 PM)
QUOTE (mvk112 @ Sep 26 2007, 11:51 AM)
he isn't getting the job done in the playoffs.


Do you realize you're basing this on 29 AB's?

29.

how many playoff at bats do you think most major league players get over the course of their careers?

your example has had 478, I'd be willing to bet there is a streak of 29 at bats where Jeter wasn't posting his .863 OPS
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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 03:02 PM
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I can't believe this thread is still going on.


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Posted: Sep 26 2007, 03:06 PM
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For a while, it was a three horse race for LVI (Least Valuable Idiot) on this board with hotspot, LIC, and defdog taking turns in the lead. Mvk is making a late season push to throw his hat into the ring to take the prize home this offseason.



I love the "how many postseason ABs do you think people get in their careers" argument. That makes a lot of sense.

And anyway, he carried the Yankees in the 2004 playoffs to the tune of a 1.014 OPS while Jeter was contributing a .686 mark. Just because they lost, it wasn't his fault.


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